Kid's Blog - HoTTopic.

[Link]

Yo it's Dr.Kid, but you can call me Kid! So I'm going to be creating a topic that's meant to be like a blog or something I can just post opinions, exciting topics, ideas and such about what could make eclipse better, possibly get feed back from other members and post about improvements I'm noticing on the site as well as things that are diminishing or getting worse.

How it will work, I'll update the blog by adding on to the original post, then I'll let the members know if there's a new section by posting, hopefully I'll get my own sub forum for this if it gives off a good feel.

**Entry 1 (Changes!):**

>! I made a rant a couple of days ago in anger in which I pointed out a few topics such as inactive staff, an un-organized way of user ranking some other opinions about why the site is going down drain and so on. I'd like to say good going on a few things, I've seen up to 4-5 admins on in one day lately, I'm glad to see the staff getting more active, next step is more communication in the admin zone, get some eclipse events going, get interactive with the members, make us want to visit and come back and contribute, members want something worth contributing towards.
>!  
>! Another thing I brought to the light is that Matt should be promoted to admin, of course I suggested this a few times, but after the topic it was done, not saying I'm his reason for promotion, he's been promoted because he fits the criteria. Though I may have shed a little light on that. Good going I'd like to say that he's already doing a fantastic job in what no other admin has done as far as I've seen. He contacted me and asked me about some problems, talked to me about what I think can be done to make them better and so on, I want to see more of the from the rest of the staff, he's a new admin and already showing great leadership, follow his example because I honestly think most of you have forgotten what it means to hold that position, this is not to disrespect any of you, but I think I'd be a better admin than a few of the current admins, anyway that's that.
>!  
>! In other news, this years April fools was pretty lame, hopefully you guys get more creative next year, Harlem shake is played out and it wasn't dazzling not to mention I didn't even get to see it as it didn't show for me.
>!  
>! That's it for entry number 1 folks, feel free to post your feed back, your own opinions about what can make eclipse a better place and what you think the staff can do to make it happen, please try not to bash obviously hope we can all be mature here.
>!  
>! - Kid

[maddy]

Hey, Kid!   :girl:   It's good to know that Matt asked for some suggestions from you and I hope Matt is also not setting aside about asking some suggestions, advises, etc.  to all of the STAFFS here.    :lol: Well, guyz here (member or staff) are very welcome to open some suggestions.  As long as it's written in a nice way, why not?   :P

You're correct, eclipse is improving and I'm  looking forward that we will be one big HAPPY COMMUNITY!

                                                                                                                                                                                     maddy    ;)

[BeNjO]


I'd like to think if it wasnt for the above guy none of this would of happened. Good going!

lets hope this dosnt turn into a slagfest.

[jcsnider]

I find this a little funny.

I am going to tackle some of the points from the point of view of an admin, a full time student, a part time employee, a full time league player, and a part time family "guy" and I am planning a 2 month trip this summer in which ill be leaving for when school lets out..

> I made a rant a couple of days ago in anger in which I pointed out a few topics such as inactive staff, an un-organized way of user ranking some other opinions about why the site is going down drain and so on. I'd like to say good going on a few things, I've seen up to 4-5 admins on in one day lately, I'm glad to see the staff getting more active, next step is more communication in the admin zone, get some eclipse events going, get interactive with the members, make us want to visit and come back and contribute, members want something worth contributing towards.

Some staff are inactive, others are not. Recently I have been extremely inactive and at least for a few more weeks that will remain the case. We all have lives, I am mainly caught up in school and am trying to get my grades up and finish up this semester with a 3.5 or higher GPA next month. In the past few days I have been more active but mainly because I have been cleaning up messes surrounding the site.

Eclipse events require someone to plan, setup, advertise and run. Even when you were a mod several events were talked about but no one really stepped up because there are time commitments that we cannot make. With that said, you don't have to be a mod to host a movie night or a rap battle topic :/.

Furthermore, a lot of our members join because of the game engine, we have over 11 thousand EO4 servers registered and every single time I go to approve user accounts I roll my eyes at the 20 or 30 people I check before approving each time. As of now unique site visits has increased by several hundred since the site switch last year and that number continues to rise. 

> Another thing I brought to the light is that Matt should be promoted to admin, of course I suggested this a few times, but after the topic it was done, not saying I'm his reason for promotion, he's been promoted because he fits the criteria. Though I may have shed a little light on that. Good going I'd like to say that he's already doing a fantastic job in what no other admin has done as far as I've seen. He contacted me and asked me about some problems, talked to me about what I think can be done to make them better and so on, I want to see more of the from the rest of the staff, he's a new admin and already showing great leadership, follow his example because I honestly think most of you have forgotten what it means to hold that position, this is not to disrespect any of you, but I think I'd be a better admin than a few of the current admins, anyway that's that.

Not to tear down any admins on the site, but being an admin is almost the difference in being red or blue. You are right, Matt is and has been a really good mod for some time so Amish talked to him and he was promoted but when it comes down to it, an admin is a glorified title.

For no good reason, titles are precious on this site. Ranqe accidently being promoted to Legend sparked at least a part of your first rant when a simple PM containing "Hey, why was Ranqe promoted to legend?" would have had the same end result of his postion being reverted.

Anyways, a mod should be able to have just as big of an impact as an admin, Matt is now an admin but have you seen him actually use his elevated power? Here is a hint, he has taken 2 admin actions and both were to fix his display name.

Matt contacting others about what they would like to see changed in the site is great, but also something he could have done as a mod. He can post suggestions in the admin zone and we can talk about them. Does it make him a better admin? Sure. But right now I don't have time to do that. (Refer to my second sentence.) I also know for a fact that Amish is also pretty tied up right now too.

> but I think I'd be a better admin than a few of the current admins, anyway that's that.

You have already proven that statement to be entirely false. Doing nothing is better than taking irresponsible actions and then having yourself demoted for it.

> In other news, this years April fools was pretty lame, hopefully you guys get more creative next year, Harlem shake is played out and it wasn't dazzling not to mention I didn't even get to see it as it didn't show for me.

I'll take that. Generally admins and mods talk about it for a month or two beforehand, get ideas and if any site changes are required they are coded to go live when needed. Refer back to my second sentence about me being busy. April Fools never crossed my mind until Amish mentioned it at 11:40pm March 31st. The Harlem Shake was pretty funny to watch (sorry you couldn't witness it) but it was thrown together quick. Hopefully next year there will be more planning involved beforehand.

> That's it for entry number 1 folks, feel free to post your feed back, your own opinions about what can make eclipse a better place and what you think the staff can do to make it happen, please try not to bash obviously hope we can all be mature here.

Fair enough but in future posts think about it from the average user side. What can YOU do to make the site more enjoyable for yourself and others around you. I am going to leave this quote here just because it came to mind.

> My fellow ~~Americans~~ _Eclipsians_, ask not what your ~~country~~ _community_ can do for you, ask what you can do for your ~~country~~ _community_.
>
> [John F. Kennedy](http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/john_f_kennedy.html) (Revised by JC Snider)

[PD]

Kid, you patsy. Assassinate him!

The next entry should be interesting.

[Link]

Alright I was a college student, had a full time job, I'm in the navy and such, this did not stop me from doing what needed to be done, sure you have in-active staff, but when you're working at your job you can't say ..well I have a life outside of this, your boss wont care and you'll be fired. Don't take on something if you can't handle the responsibility, I can't help that you're 16 and don't have on your big boy pants, because someone who has that spare time and doesn't mind should occupy your seat instead, you can't tell me I'm wrong. Quite frankly it's your forums, you're just being lazy and using excuses by saying "Well you guys can throw your own parties"…if we can run things ourselves what do we need you guys for? To flaunt colors? I

Oh, I wasn't going to get angry until you called me out on false information, make no mistake...I was not demoted, I personally asked to not be a moderator for a couple of weeks, and then I QUIT, I didn't get demoted, the reasons I stepped down I don't need to explain, but I don't appreciate you trying to put it out there as if I left on bad terms, it was not the case, I have skype conversations with Amish to confirm this as well as other mods. You're out of place.

If mods and admins are the same then I'm sorry you guys have a form of mental retardation not to get rid of color codes, again a lack on management part, of course my topic was quick to get deleted when multiple members started agreeing and I wasn't going to be a douche until you started getting off topic. But now I'll point out facts, absolutely none of your mods are active besides Maddy. You can't call the people on the admin team admins because obviously you have your definition of what an admin does mixed up.

I keep finding blocks on blocks on blocks of how bad you guys are at managing this forums and a * load of members would agree, that's the hard core truth. I could indeed do better than most of your management team, I mainly quit because of that which is also stated in skype.

Also I'm a member now, I'm not required to pm anyone bud, there's an off topic section for a reason, if I want to post a wall of text I'm allowed to do so, if you guys actually had rules (YET ANOTHER REASON I QUIT) then maybe I'd have a guideline to follow, but of course when I was a mod that was another complaint of members in which I brought to your attention.

- Kid

[SkywardRiver]

I agree with points made on both sides. Let's just keep it civil all around eh?

[JohnPony]

Get owned, noob.

[Link]

It would be civil if people didn't always say things that don't need to be said, I literally made this first entry to congratulate on what I thought was progress, but then you have hypocrite snider who says well maybe you should have pm'd us about Ranqe, well instead of ruining my topic and making false statements you could have pm'd me and maybe gave me some suggestions on what you thought was wrong about my topic, but of course you wont even follow your own advice. Why do I even try here sometimes.

- Kid

[jcsnider]

I may not be the right person commenting here. My job (as I see it) is to keep the forums updated and online. Other than that I honestly have no desire to be the forum manager, peace keeper, party planner etc… really, that work just came with the territory of programming the engine. As for saying I have a life outside of Eclipse and there will be times were I won't be very active, that was something that was understood by Amish when I was hired. As far as my admin rank goes, the second I am no longer on-call to make theme updates, approve members, change site pages, etc I will be demoting myself to a regular user group. (I don't care which one.)

With that said, the half of the story in which you quit never made it to me. Last I heard (literally 3 days ago) you were still asking to me reinstated (which was implied again in your first post).

I said a PM would be easier and more appropriate than starting a public topic when the topic at hand could potentially be taken offensively by Ranqe in the end. (That is a common sense judgement call, not a requirement but also a good moderation decision to remove.)

You are allowed to have large walls of text as long as they remain civil but at the end of the day we can delete anything we want if we feel like it doesn't benefit the site at all.

For the record, here are the posted [rules](http://www.eclipseorigins.com/community/index.php?/topic/131525-rules-updated/#entry876631). They are slightly out of date but all of them apply. Any other decisions made are at the discretion of the mods/admins at that time. Common sense helps here.

Regards,

JC

[Link]

I made sure to note that it was no offense to Ranqe and that he was a great kid, just to clear that up. Also when I was a mod rules for the shout box were not made clear in fact we were told it's to our discretion, I was then told we needed to send a pm of course that only caused conflicts with judgement calls, in fact Matt has suffered that here tonight which will be in my second entry tomorrow regarding Doug. I don't see how you thought I was demoted, for one the case about me muting a member was never gone over, the reason I quit is because I openly asked not to be a mod for (Two weeks, statements on skype) and when I asked you to make me a mod again when Amish was not around you told me I was not to be made a mod again and I was ignored by your leader so I sent a resignation letter and asked to be a legend, in which I instantly got thrown into the group, which I took as a sign of disrespect and or being "demoted" without even being given a reason or explanation.

This topic was not at all made to offend anyone, it's meant to group the community together to point out problems that we might all commonly see or even good things that we might see in the hopes the the admin team might recognize these and not leave the community to manage itsself, it's like asking a new born baby to find out how to feed itself, of course that's a bad reference, in any case no hard feelings.

But hopefully some of the points made will be taken to Amish which personally I don't know if he cares about it or not.

- Kid

[JohnPony]

While we're on the subject of complaining, can I have my NSFW group now?

[Zzbrandon]

It was just a name tag color, I am not sure why so many people got butt hurt me having it for a few days. Of course it was going to be removed it was a mistake.

[Link]

Essentially the topic was not about you personally, it was about inequality, I didn't think it was fair to some veterans or other members who may have contributed more and been here longer, Ranqe I have nothing against you personally and I wouldn't care if you kept the tag I never asked for it to be removed in the first place, I just don't think it made sense for you to have that role before some others and in the end you still got thrown into the veteran group so it doesn't really matter.

Also for JC, those rules go by the points system, it's a conflict of what action to even take on them, that list is invalid until updated.

[Richy420Rich]

My blog is this:

Eclipse Origins 4.0 is a marketing engine, while still being in VB6\. Many users of old escaped the programming language that is still being used here. Eclipse V is still in the works, while Eclipse V is not opened for public marketing, the reason for the lack of users lies with the users preference of engine.

Community, defined as being members interacting with each other on a close basis. Admins and Mods really have naught to do with this action, but rather they are to supervise the process of interactions.

Admins and Mods need to be giving me coffee, adding more arcade games on the forums and fixing EO 4 bugs, these are those granted Admin positions and must supply their consumers. /trollface

Seriously though, making Eclipse members stay, starts with the members itself. Mods and Admins are there to run the forum, dictate multiple situations and keep it all clean and safe.

[jcsnider]

> Also for JC, those rules go by the points system, it's a conflict of what action to even take on them, that list is invalid until updated.

The list is dated, I admit but the rules apply either way.

[Growlith1223]

I just wanna reply on the whole "ECLIPZ S INCRSNG, I CAN HAZ MEMBERS" i wanna say this is entirely false by a large margin, i see no improvement on how many members are on the site. I have stated before, before you 2 took over the forums, there were about 2000 members on at once ALL the time, however now, it seems to be that there's barely like 20 or 30 now. can't really judge the forums like that but it basically explains what's going on with the forums.

Another thing i would like to mention is that there are certain topics being deleted even though they actually do BENEFIT the forums. but it seems only you don't see it that way. Im surprised this topic lasted this long too, usually it gets deleted for apparent "Flaming" when it's literally just opinions.

I do have to agree with what Kid said, the staff on here seem to somewhat not know what they are doing, with the exception of certain ones. There's literally only one moderator from what i have seen, the rest are admins. try and balance it out, yea?

Anywho, i also want to say, your "11 thousand EO 4 servers" thing is complete bull. even if it was true however, most of them will probably be dead weight.

That's just my 2 cents, anywho i shall be back to see who replies to this :)

Sincerely,
Growlith1223

[jcsnider]

> I just wanna reply on the whole "ECLIPZ S INCRSNG, I CAN HAZ MEMBERS" i wanna say this is entirely false by a large margin, i see no improvement on how many members are on the site. I have stated before, before you 2 took over the forums, there were about 2000 members on at once ALL the time, however now, it seems to be that there's barely like 20 or 30 now. can't really judge the forums like that but it basically explains what's going on with the forums.

This is false. "Most Online Ever: 2,053 (May 11, 2008, 03:38:56 pm)" That was one massive day 6 years ago (when Eclipse was still on smf) and the majority of the visitors were guests. So 2000 members on at any given time is laughable and completely exaggerated.

> Another thing i would like to mention is that there are certain topics being deleted even though they actually do BENEFIT the forums. but it seems only you don't see it that way. Im surprised this topic lasted this long too, usually it gets deleted for apparent "Flaming" when it's literally just opinions.

Some topics have been hidden and deleted. Whether a topic benefits the forum is a matter of personal opinion.  I think Kid's first rant was hidden by Matt who was praised in the topic. This topic specially has minimal potential to be beneficial which is why we are responding and keeping it around.

> I do have to agree with what Kid said, the staff on here seem to somewhat not know what they are doing, with the exception of certain ones. There's literally only one moderator from what i have seen, the rest are admins. try and balance it out, yea?

The site isn't filled with trash, we have enough people to get the job done. Would you suggest that we take half the admins and demote them? Or would you recommend we hire mods that we don't need and would eventually be attacked in these kinds of topics anyways?

> Anywho, i also want to say, your "11 thousand EO 4 servers" thing is complete bull. even if it was true however, most of them will probably be dead weight.

It is a legit statistic. EO4 has been downloaded well over 20,000 times. The 11 thousand number are people who used the server to make an account, verify their email, and get their game running at least once. I am not saying they are all active now because most of them are not but the stat is legit and something we are proud of.

JC

[Matt]

> Another thing i would like to mention is that there are certain topics being deleted even though they actually do BENEFIT the forums. but it seems only you don't see it that way. Im surprised this topic lasted this long too, usually it gets deleted for apparent "Flaming" when it's literally just opinions.

While topics might benefit the community, it's their nature that get's them removed. There's a big difference between cussing your way to make a point, and writing a topic in a mature way. While I agreed with most of Kid's points, I still hid the topic because he chose an abusive way of making them. If you have any inquiries as to why any other topics were removed, send me a PM and I'll be glad to explain why.

> I just wanna reply on the whole "ECLIPZ S INCRSNG, I CAN HAZ MEMBERS" i wanna say this is entirely false by a large margin, i see no improvement on how many members are on the site. I have stated before, before you 2 took over the forums, there were about 2000 members on at once ALL the time, however now, it seems to be that there's barely like 20 or 30 now. can't really judge the forums like that but it basically explains what's going on with the forums.

I don't really think there were several hundred of us on at once, there were definitely more. We had at least fifty or so registered users on at a time on average, and there was quite a bit of activity. However, you have to take into account how when Amish bought the site, a good portion of the active users flooded to their refugee forums, and even to this day, there are people who are still upset about the change.

While I myself was upset when it happened, and I still do miss Marsh, users need to realize two things. Most of the on-site moderation comes from the same old moderators, and we are not out to get you. Secondly, as Richy mentioned, members are a part of the community. As friendly as Agoraphobic is, it's hard for him to convince a new member to stay on his own.

[kibbelz]

I don't agree on hiring more mods/admins. Why? because if they're not going to contribute anything that already isn't here then there's no need adding excess admins/mods. I myself am not the best admin, I freely admit that. Like JC I currently am caught up in life and school however wish to continue on EO 4.0\. once exams are over and I can be more active. I also agree with Matt and Richy:

> Secondly, as Richy mentioned, members are a part of the community. As friendly as Agoraphobic is, it's hard for him to convince a new member to stay on his own.

This is very true, The 'members' of the community also have a role to play in situations such as this alongside organizing events and keeping the forums clean by stopping it at its source by changing users attitude.

I do agree with Kid on the rules though, We DO need better rules and CLEAR rules which we currently do not have.

But lets not forget, Many people say that eclipse has gone downhill after marsh left. That is not true at all. Eclipse had been going downhill for some time after Robin stopped developing EO 2.0\. and looking at the stats, JC is right. Member activity has increased since Robin left, Agreed before he did leave there was more activity however overall activity has increased since then.

-Kibbelz

[Link]

I can't edit the original post, so I have no choice but to place the new entry here!

**Entry 2 (Rules, Events and Custom user groups!)**:

>! First thing is first, it was already my plan to add this as an entry, but the staff should get together an discuss a set of stable rules and how to handle them, the points system is now ancient history. In fact there was a problem with this yesterday a member, **Doug**, was conflicted about a judgement call made by a staff member yesterday, I'll keep the name of that staff member disclosed as it's what I see fit. Now in my opinion, both sides had great points on the argument! The staff member, was acting upon his emotion and made a judgement call, no harm in that, however here's where my problem comes in; When I was a mod we were told the chat was to our discretion and to make calls based on what we think is right or wrong, I believe this is a flawed system.
>!  
>! Not only can it lead to conflicts between users and staff, it can lead to doubt in self judgement. This endangers both staff and members alike, there should be rules set in stone or guidelines to be followed even for the shout box. Staff should need to always screen shot and provide evidence of their claim and maybe even send a pm warning the user depending on the severity of the act.
>!  
>! Second thing I wanted to move towards was user planned events, this message is specifically to all the users, if you did not know it is not just up to the staff to plan events, we ourselves can take part in this, interact with the staff and plan things, you have the power to make the community as fun as you'd like it! The staff are very reasonable when members approach them with ideas!
>!  
>! My third and final note for today is something that MajorTom brought to my attention yesterday. We should bring custom user groups back! Maybe these can be won in an event and maybe who ever wins the event can allow up to 5 - 10 people in their user group, something like what we used to do with tournaments!
>!  
>!  
>! That's it for entry number 2 everyone! Post comments, opinions and ideas!
>!  
>! - Kid

[SkywardRiver]

I'll see if I can arrange a contest. You're absolutely right, members ARE the forum. If we can't make it happen, no one can.

(the only problem is, I want to compete as well, so I may have to have someone else step in and select the contest parameters. [if it's gonna be a mapping contest or programming contest or whatever] as I don't want to be considered being given an advantage by choosing the parameters)

I would LOVE to have the top prize be a custom user group in which you can invite up to say 10 people or something, just as Kid has suggested. 

I also agree that staff, when regarding something as 'serious' as a ban, should NOT let emotion cloud their judgement. Prove that you're real Jedi and be impartial. Justice is blind…

[Exception]

There's something here I feel obliged to point out.

You, as members, may believe that Eclipse is a democracy.

It isn't.

I can't name any one forum that is.

Carry on.

[jcsnider]

> First thing is first, it was already my plan to add this as an entry, but the staff should get together an discuss a set of stable rules and how to handle them, the points system is now ancient history. In fact there was a problem with this yesterday a member, **Doug**, was conflicted about a judgement call made by a staff member yesterday, I'll keep the name of that staff member disclosed as it's what I see fit. Now in my opinion, both sides had great points on the argument! The staff member, was acting upon his emotion and made a judgement call, no harm in that, however here's where my problem comes in; When I was a mod we were told the chat was to our discretion and to make calls based on what we think is right or wrong, I believe this is a flawed system.

We are revising the rules now. The problem is, 90% of the issues I am asked to deal with is at my own discretion because not only are there no rules laid in motion against them, there is also no precedent to base action on. When it comes to the Doug case, everything was documented in the admin section by the mod in question. He made a judgement call and I stand by it. The resulting action was a ban (maybe a little overkill) but the mod attempted other actions first including a shoutbox mute beforehand which was unsuccessful. (This has since been worked out.)

> Not only can it lead to conflicts between users and staff, it can lead to doubt in self judgement. This endangers both staff and members alike, there should be rules set in stone or guidelines to be followed even for the shout box. Staff should need to always screen shot and provide evidence of their claim and maybe even send a pm warning the user depending on the severity of the act.

Generally actions taken are documented in the warning system, otherwise the mod/admin makes a topic in the admin section with documentation. Shoutbox rules are the same as forum rules except it is a shoutbox. At the very least, if something is questionable, don't post it. (That applies for 90% of the sites on the web)

> My third and final note for today is something that MajorTom brought to my attention yesterday. We should bring custom user groups back! Maybe these can be won in an event and maybe who ever wins the event can allow up to 5 - 10 people in their user group, something like what we used to do with tournaments!

You can take this one to Amish but last I remember we intentionally took time out to remove the custom groups. If anything they contributed to an elitist attitude towards other groups.

[SkywardRiver]

> If anything they contributed to an elitist attitude towards other groups.

I don't seem to recall this, but whatever.