Evaluate one of my maps

[iHero]


_Please, give your notes, criticisms and suggestions._

[Zetasis]

Looks pretty good. Was this made using your engine EP?

[Fuu]

No criticism required, friend.

[Murdoc]

Yea i have to agree with Boobs.. theres nothing to be critiqued.. you used the transition tiles properly, made good use of layers, and the map has variety. kudos!

[MadalinV]

Wow! this is verry good! i could never make one like that ^^

[hisherwin]

Not bad , but not the best neither .. The yellow mushroom is out of place … but overall 8/10

[iHero]

Thanks to all

[Dark Crusade]

Visually looks great, although I suspect in a tile-based game it's going to be very hard to move around, especially with multiple players and NPC enemies.

[Marsh]

> Visually looks great, although I suspect in a tile-based game it's going to be very hard to move around, especially with multiple players and NPC enemies.

This, the first thing i thought when seeing this map was "What a great map, what a shame to be ruined by a tiled walking system" Switch to per pixel walking and its fantastic.

[Kusy]

Ok… can we stop doing this after so many bloody years?

It's not great. It's not good. It's mediocre at best.

And it's not the amount of time you put in it, it's not about your skill as a map designer, it;s not the tile based system.

It's the fact that you're using a ducking decade (decade+) old tileset that everybody here and everywhere else knows and remembers in great ducking detail.

Think of it as sculpting in shit. No matter what magic you'll do with it - it's shit. And it stinks.

And sculpting in shit might be received as a symptom of retardation.

Don't take it in a wrong way mate, but my deeply rooted ethics prevents me from giving praise to anyone using RPG maker stock graphics. It's something that should be stigmatized.

I could also give some more constructive feedback. Like… it's uninspired and serves no purpose. You showcased a road from nowhere to nowhere, without any particular details or interesting features. A clusterfuck of trees will remain a clusterfuck of trees, no matter how nice you arrange them. I used the word "designer" before - I think this hits the spot - this map is not designed, Plan something out before you start it.

> No criticism required, friend.

Have sex with him already. Buddy.

I'm starting to understand what a certain Brit meant when he told me this place is destructive for any kind of creativity.

[Dark Crusade]

Don't be too discouraged from Kusys comment, members whom have been around for long have seen the tileset used to death repeatively, although it's clear that you have an eye for good taste and mapping, some (especially Kusy), can't see too far past the poop that is RMXP tilesets. Personally, I really like your map, but of course like most, I wouldn't play another game using RMXP graphics. I'd still like to see more of your work, perhaps utilising a more original tileset. Appearing as an exceptional mapper, perhaps you'd even have a grasp of level design or something else?

[Kusy]

I can see past it. But seeing makes me not wanna.

And as I said, seriously. This is a nowhere map, without a plan, without any idea for itself.

He used fringes, bravo. He added detail, marvelous. Now can we get past this weird tendency to praise people for not being shitty, give actual feedback and then optionally praise them for being good if they get there?

This is not a good map, and I gave valid reasons to back that opinion, dismissing it just because I like to be harsh in delivering won't change anything.

I'm not going to evaluate how you hammer nails and bang two planks together in a nice manner. Build something useful and we can discuss what's wrong or good with it.

[Dark Crusade]

There's no comparison between hammering two planks together and mapping. The planks are going to look the same, and have the same appeal and use almost no matter what (unless its a ducking wreck). So when it comes to mapping, and showing off mapping, we can comment and critique on a handful of things. The tileset, the detail, practicality in game, and most importantly the appeal, whether it looks good or not.

[Greendude120]

> Visually looks great, although I suspect in a tile-based game it's going to be very hard to move around, especially with multiple players and NPC enemies.

This is true. I thought about this b4 reading his comment.

* * *

@kusy: i think ppl rate his work knowing those limitations u pointed out. Ur not here to tell him to switch engine or tileset, ur here to see if he has done the best possible outcome given those tiles. It is above average when comparing with maps from others on this community.

* * *

> Not bad , but not the best neither .. The yellow mushroom is out of place … but overall 8/10

> 

Oh this is beautifully ironic.

[DMF]

well sadly i agree with kusy. but not how he said it. the tiles are old and we have seen it a million times. now its a nice work. but i personaly think its too much. also you should thin some trees and stuff. ill explain why. in a real forest its random but in a real forest there is still room to move besides a trail. i agree with mash on pixel movement. but using tiles your not used to seeing will help.

[Kusy]

> There's no comparison between hammering two planks together and mapping. The planks are going to look the same, and have the same appeal and use almost no matter what (unless its a ducking wreck). So when it comes to mapping, and showing off mapping, we can comment and critique on a handful of things. The tileset, the detail, practicality in game, and most importantly the appeal, whether it looks good or not.

The comparison was about general knowledge of how to use tools and putting them to good use. He knows how to use the map editor. Great. Now I'd like to see him use that knowledge to make an actual map that has a functionality. A map without functionality, or as we discussed - level design, is just an image, a bitmap. And if I'm going to judge it as such, I will judge it solely based on the fact that he used tiles that are so overused it hurts.

Of course you could counter this by saying that filler maps have to exist, and that would be true. But then it would be just stupid to choose the most bland and uninteresting part of your game's world and show it to people. And if you give me something like that out of context, don't expect me to fill in the blanks and imagine how great the map just behind the corner might be.

You guys are talking about tile movement working against this map. I'm talking about the exact same thing - this map was not designed to work, it was made to look pretty, to showoff knowledge of how to use the map editor. It's a collage of tiles. If things he's showing here (correct use of fringe, sufficient level of detail, variety) were applied to actual design - it might be good.

@Greendude. I'm not here to pat people on their back just because they are not miserably bad at doing something like everyone else, that's for sure. Start reading amigo. We got past the fact that his choice of resources is bad. Now we're discussing that this map has bad map design if any. How about you give me some counterarguments to that?

And what "beautifully ironic" do you see here? Because the way I see it, more effort and skill is required to pixel out a single tree, than to make a map that doesn't look horrid with a preexisting tileset.

[Greendude120]

> And what "beautifully ironic" do you see here? Because the way I see it, more effort and skill is required to pixel out a single tree, than to make a map that doesn't look horrid with a preexisting tileset.

Ur right. Def more efforts. I never said neither put no effort, or one did more than the other.

What's ironic tho is the final result. I prefer op by far.

Btw i wasnt tryn to argue with ur wall of txt. Too many debates on this forum. Get bored of reading speeches.

[Nook]

Technical: 8/10

Creativity: 3/10

Functionality: 3/10

Overall: 4.5/10

I'd go into detail, but Kusy has already said it better than I could.

[Fuu]

Well Kusy, you act like I'm the first person to praise people.

Tbh, I figured it would be useless to say just about anything other than "wow it's shitty" or "it's really good", because it's obvious this person can barely speak English, and we _really_ don't need to go over the "Please use Google Translator" thing again.

Though valid points made, OP will only take in about 10% of it.

[Xolani]

> Ok… can we stop doing this after so many bloody years?
>
> It's not great. It's not good. It's mediocre at best.
>
> And it's not the amount of time you put in it, it's not about your skill as a map designer, it;s not the tile based system.
>
> It's the fact that you're using a ducking decade (decade+) old tileset that everybody here and everywhere else knows and remembers in great ducking detail.
>
> Think of it as sculpting in shit. No matter what magic you'll do with it - it's shit. And it stinks.
>
> And sculpting in shit might be received as a symptom of retardation.
>
> Don't take it in a wrong way mate, but my deeply rooted ethics prevents me from giving praise to anyone using RPG maker stock graphics. It's something that should be stigmatized.

I found this comment to be quite stupid. Yes of course if you've worked with eclipse before you're probably familiar with the rpg maker tileset, but so what? If your making a game for other's to play it is highly unlikely that people playing your game will even know what a tileset is and if they do even more unlikely they will recognize where the tilesett came from. And even if by some remote chance your players have seen your tile sett well… again so what?

The rpg maker tileset is a great set that's pretty versatile. I've been on these forums on and off for years and I still see new things being done with the same "old" tileset.

Don't mind Kusy's comment it wasn't properly thought out.

Anyway your map looks quite good.

As a tip sometimes I like to add those little sprouts on the same tile as tree stumps or bases. Just pop em down on a lower level and it helps to vary your tree bases a little.

[Dark Crusade]

> but so what? If your making a game for other's to play it is highly unlikely that people playing your game will even know what a tileset is and if they do even more unlikely they will recognize where the tilesett came from. And even if by some remote chance your players have seen your tile sett well… again so what?

Of cause players will recognise where it came from. Especially an indie title. They might not recognise it from RMXP maker, but they'll recognise it from dozens of other RMXP games and ORPGs like Eclipse. Plus it makes the game appear very unoriginal, and unappealing to many. Your players will not be console gamers who have only ever played Call of Duty and Halo before, it will be players who most likely enjoy old or retro themed RPGs, and fellow indie players who would have definately seen the graphics before.

[jackmarknow]

Looks pretty good. Was this made using your engine EP?