jcsnider Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Starting a topic because this this topic is getting old in the shoutbox.In one specific case very recently our beloved Richy was warned in the shoutbox for shouting multiple lines of a song in all caps.Let me make a few points clear:1. The shoutbox was inactive, there were no ongoing conversations for Richy to interrupt, no one to really annoy.2. Given the inactivity it is possible that the activity could have stimulated actual conversation in the shoutbox.3. Third, the rules give the specific example under the section of "Spamming" - **typing in all capital letters, and any other disrupting behavior deemed inappropriate by staff.**4. The moderator to issue the warning was not in the wrong, according to the rules.My argument is that given the circumstances, moderators should be given some extent of discretion on when an action is considered spamming which, by definition, is the sending of annoying messages.The rules should be modified to extend this idea so moderators are not feeling forced to punish members who are causing no real harm.Open discussion and queue the flaming –-- NOW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcsnider Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Sorry for the double post, Legends cannot edit their own posts in this section due to broken forum permissions.I would like to follow up by saying that Richy did get banned after further complaint which he accepts & agrees with - but it was for 24 hours.There is at no point on the rules that ever call for a 24 hour ban! Why follow the rules to a point on something that is so simple as shouting in CAPS and then not following them when handing out bans?I cannot find logical reasoning here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcsnider Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Going to follow up one last time with a few more points. Again, I cannot edit so I apologize for the triple post. If an admin wants to fix permissions I will gladly merge these together or I welcome any mod/admin to do it for me.I went on to talk a little bit more with Agoraphobic & Richy. I would like the preface this with the fact that I consider Agora as a long time friend.Here is our conversation:[Large image warning]>! [http://i.imgur.com/JqjsiS9.png](http://i.imgur.com/JqjsiS9.png) – Hyperlink for reference.>! I feel like there is a lot wrong with the whole situation and I continue to welcome any thoughts. I will try my best to refrain from a quadra-post.-JC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaKku Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Theres rules for a reason and your suppose to follow them so things like this wont happen and if you break them then its your own fault for getting a warning/ban. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Problems with rule enforcement and impartiality has been a part of eclipse since eclipse, there are many gray lines and many will/can be playing favorites.Would it be logical to believe that maybe; The entire staff did not agree on the rules context? If so, Mod1 would enforce the rule stronger but Mod2 would be lighter? This causes impartiality.Would it also be logical to believe that maybe; I am friends with Mod1, so Mod1 won't ban me, but Mod2 will ban me? This causes for impartiality.Btw: Give me a 3 day shoutbox mute like it says in the rules if you're really going to go ham with the rules lmao, the hell? Hahaha. It defies logic indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnGod Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Johnson has been a moderator for three days and is a teenager what exactly are you expecting of the guy? this is overboard.i was trying to talk to him about being more mild with his moderating but you all should expect hes going to make mistakes in the course of learning what works and doesnt.Reguarding the rules, they're vague with several catchalls that make anything against the rules. nobody can be expected to enforce this ruleset strictly but i dont think Link even expected that, i think johnson was just being hard on himself. from what johnson had said, link told him to use his judgement which to me means his own discretion on when the rules should be enforced.The rules could use work but johnson is only going to learn more out of experience. to expect him to be a good moderator after three days and attack him for making mistakes is complete bull. @richy: if you have advice for him you should present that advice as logically and kindly so he might actually be receptive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Not my fault that the staff does not want to train their people, and to be honest, if my name ain't Link, he would not listen anyways. He's following Link's order, and that's fine.I personally don't have any beef with Johnson, his move was his move, my move was my move. At the end of the day, it's Eclipse that's getting hurt over the constraint and controlling of the community on the basis of rule context and impartiality, this bum candy don't make or break me lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I'm sitting on 9 screenshots that shows rule violation on Johnson's part, which have been sent to Link, Agora & (Xel, as of tonight). Has Johnson been warned for inciting drama, insulting? Probably not. Nobody knows the half days prior to this caplocking event. If I may be allowed to upload them all for debate purposes? *Checks the rules*; I have no clue…[attachment=1454:Johnson.zip] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohenjo Daro Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I don't know why everyone's getting worked up about this, he's new to the job and still learning, if I had to guess, it was probably a case of, here's the rules, enforce them and use your judgement. I say just ease up on him, let him learn through his own screw ups, it's usually the best way to learn. And I know that it doesn't seem like it, but Johnson does listen to what you tell him unless you're being haughty about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnGod Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 > Not my fault that the staff does not want to train their people, and to be honest, if my name ain't Link, he would not listen anyways. He's following Link's order, and that's fine.> > I personally don't have any beef with Johnson, his move was his move, my move was my move. At the end of the day, it's Eclipse that's getting hurt over the constraint and controlling of the community on the basis of rule context and impartiality, this bum candy don't make or break me lol.ok, il be much clearer then. you are being an asshole about a kid acting like a kid who was put in charge of a CHATROOM by another kid in which you were being a defiant little prick spamming caps because somebody told you not to. its not your fault the staff didnt "train" their chatroom moderator no. its your fault for being 33 and knowing nothing about people.grow the hell up and stop crying over kids being kids. and for the future.this is the last time im going to address you concidering your uselessness. its your own business if you want to snipe at me with dramatic comments like the little retard you are would do. Il ignore them, il let you say them without saying anything. but please take this reality check and stop being a jackass to a kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Request this topic gets removed, it's dumb and stupid. EclipseMember - 1, it's that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohenjo Daro Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 > Request this topic gets removed, it's dumb and stupid. EclipseMember - 1, it's that simple.So you're leaving Eclipse because you got a warning for using caps? Wow… that's petty...> ok, il be much clearer then.> > you are being an arsehole about a kid acting like a kid who was put in charge of a CHATROOM by another kid in which you were being a defiant little prick spamming caps because somebody told you not to. its not your fault the staff didnt "train" their chatroom moderator no. its your fault for being 33 and knowing nothing about people.> > grow the hell up and stop crying over kids being kids. and for the future.> > this is the last time im going to address you concidering your uselessness. its your own business if you want to snipe at me with dramatic comments like the little retard you are would do. Il ignore them, il let you say them without saying anything. but please take this reality check and stop being a jackass to a kid.Try to be more civil in your insulting please, it's better to not be name-calling and to actually argue a point, it also makes you look less childish and easier to side with, I'm sure you already knew but just a reminder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Yes, apart from the updates on Labyrinth Hearts (Under Agora's command and board). I'm done with the shoutbox and forum functions of this site.Rules are rules and if they're that strict, according to the last 3 days of screenshots I posted; I don't want to risk a permenant ban because I'm still working on LH under EO4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohenjo Daro Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Well, hopefully you'll be back once they change the rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 My input, it's bad the situation turned out like this, however Johnson is very new and still learning. All the staff saw Johnson as a potential mod and agreed on him, I don't think he intentionally did anything. He messages me for just about every situation to make sure he's not going overboard, I was in that same boat when I first god mod status on eclipse a while ago. I'm not saying how this turned out was right, but he wont learn without mistakes, in all honesty I think he's trying to prove himself a good moderator and that's what I need. Someone not afraid to enforce rules due to friendships or bias.Hopefully things pan out between you both, it seems more like a misunderstanding, but I have told him to go off the rules as well as his judgement. I reviewed this and I talked to you personally Richy, you seem to have understood. I also talked to Johnson and he seems to have understood. This is a bit more overboard than it needs to be, I've watched people even turn on you when you first became a shoutbox mod Richy. You know how hard it is to enforce rules without wanting people to be mad at you or thinking you've changed.Everyone just needs to chill out right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Yes that's why I left position of power, because it's hard work to enforce rules under friendships and bias.And twice as hard to enforce the same rules on the staff as the staff enforces on the members.However, I am putting this issue behind me. Your reply and further talk on skype has brightened my day. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 So I just want to apologize to Johnson and Xel, for my rash behaviour last night, there was no excuse for my carrying on.Fixing the source of the problems is what I was hoping and aiming for, and the only way to fix the source is to debug it through all of the lines of code. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 > So I just want to apologize to Johnson and Xel, for my rash behaviour last night, there was no excuse for my carrying on.> > Fixing the source of the problems is what I was hoping and aiming for, and the only way to fix the source is to debug it through all of the lines of code.What if it's closed source, but you could pay $60 for a better version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy420Rich Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 That depends on what benefits the closed source offers compared to the open source.Personally I don't buy because I'm broke, I leech. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnGod Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 > So you're leaving Eclipse because you got a warning for using caps? Wow… that's petty...> > > > > > > > Try to be more civil in your insulting please, it's better to not be name-calling and to actually argue a point, it also makes you look less childish and easier to side with, I'm sure you already knew but just a reminder.sorry man you're right i posted that early this morning without really putting enough thought into it. i appreciate the reminder and respect your delivery of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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