Bonk

I never said you're like a father, or that you act like one to the community. TBH you act like that one permanently drunk Uncle that no-one invites to family gatherings because he rambles on about people and frequently breaks the furniture. What I said was, you're worse than my father. I meant that in the sense that my father is a prick, and you're an even bigger prick. So what do you suggest we do then? If we're going to have a community overrun with tension, surely it's up to the self-proclaimed authority figure to sort it out? Or is is just that that only applies when you feel like needlessly insulting someone?

I wasn't actually in the process of ripping it. It's the stock Mirage Realms 3.0, all I did was compile it and run the server. Do I need to put an IP= line into the config file?

I'm going to rip the guild system from Mirage Realms, but I can't seem to get the server running. Everytime it gets to 'Loading Quests', then throws out that 'The requested address is a broadcast address, but a flag is not set'. Are there any runtimes or anything I need and is so how can I come across them?

What I'm saying, Robin, is that I don't understand VB6 and it's hard for me to take it in, trust me, I've tried. Scripting seems like watered down programming to me. What we're saying is that people who aren't too bothered and are making casual games in the weekend just 'cause they're bored are having to learn VB6 back-to-front to make anything people will play. Partly this is the nature of EO, it's just a base for an ORPG. Partly it's down to peer pressure, no-one on Eclipse will point out the good parts of a project when there's bad bits. If we all took your advice and used EO on it's own, because anything we make will deface your precious source code, no-one would have a game that's playable. Then everyone would moan and whine about the lack of decent games. And you know full well where all this negativity comes from, but our Lord High Robin has every right to treat people like crap because he once made an Engine. And when people try and thank you by aiding you in arguments? @Robin: > Your input in this thread is unimportant. You've been here the grand total of two months. You know nothing about the issues which are being discussed. > > You're just playing the old game of 'follow Robin around the forum and try and argue with him' which, believe me, many people have tried. It can only end badly for you. I suggest you sort out your attitude and get the hell over whatever happened. I don't think kissing anyone's arse is a good idea, but you don't have to be such an idiot about it, Robin.

I didn't say you have to love us all Robin, but it wouldn't hurt you or take any precious time to change 'Turn the bloody server on, then. Go read the tutorials instead of assuming you know how this works' to 'Go to your server folder and start the server.exe. The tutorials cover it all, you should read them'. This is worsened when you don't realise how bad you can make people feel, Robin. Even more so for people like me. It's not warranted to be so awful. Especially when you have a small army of lemmings saying 'No.' in threads where it doesn't make any sense at all, 'You're an idiot.' when they clearly don't know what they're saying that to. The root of Eclipse's attitude problems is monkey-see-monkey-do. If you where more positive, the people trying to snub others to climp up in people's expectations might be too. Unless you can find some other method to make Eclipse a more positive place?

You didn't read what I posted earlier - It doesn't click for me. I've followed tutorials and read through VBTutor until I'm blue in the face but it just doesn't go in. And I'm not saying that Robin should come and hug everyone, I've just never seen him post _anything_ positive.

I'm with you Anna, I appreciate what Robin did, and I appreciate EO and how ES/EE/TE are defunct, what I find issue with is Robin's attitude that we all have to impress him to earn his respect. You're worse than my dad, Robin. I suppose I'll have to wait until Eclipse C comes out. Maybe that will be the touchpaper for an Eclipse we can use effectively.

How about you stop assuming things about me, Robin? You're quick to label others ignorant, but clearly don't understand that there's a high chance that the date I registered and the date I actually started using Eclipse are two completely different matters. As for whether I can occupy the moral highground, then yes. I've never once insulted anyone, nor have I ever tried to make anyone feel crap. I speak my mind and stick to my opinions, but the fact that you've been involved with the Mirage line of engines for a while doesn't constitute divine intervention and make you have the right to treat other people like crap, all the time expecting them to kiss your arse for it and then complaining when they do. You write ten-tonne of text on the homepage about how you foresaw the fall of every community, but it's right in front of your eyes that Eclipse is heading the same way and you're so blinkered by your percieved superiority that you'd rather Eclipse fell to ruins and the entire community went to rats, because as long as everything's okay in Robin World the rest of us can go to hell. I refuse to accept that. And a month in my opinion is more than enough time to formulate an opinion on you, Robin. Live by your 'What I don't like is people who don't try to learn.' motto, but don't insult those who don't understand Eclipse right off the bat. If you thought about what all the newbs you made leave this forum could have achieved, and now it's up to the very few among us who are still making games to try and make up for the lack of new people doing anything productive and that's all down to you.

I wasn't insulting you, Robin, I was pointing out that you removed something we liked. If I was insulting you, it would sound much more, for want of a better word, insulting. I cannot understand VB6 at all, scripting would have been an ease-in. There's no point saying you get tired of it all, because this must be the first time I've ever seen anyone question your work. All I've ever seen on your half is pessimism and it's dragging Eclipse down. In fact, the only person I've ever seen whine is you, posting long, rather selfish rants about how everyone steals your work, you've been here almost a decade and everyone has to earn your respect when alot of the time they don't even want it. Constructive criticism on other's work is perfectly acceptable, treating people who are starting out is not. So the pressure of answering questions well and truly gets to you, huh? But you apparently have thick skin. Right. I'm in no way dismissing the work you've done, but it's time you either stopped insulting or stopped posting, Robin.

Then maybe that's the way forward for us? I just want to find a happy medium, but I doubt the scripting boards will come back. All I think is: EO Engine with scripting, with a set of well written scripts for guilds, animated tiles, speech bubbles, pets and quests. That's all I want :/

I understand what you mean, but the whole engine needs to be edited to make an ORPG, and that's too difficult for too many of us. Logic says get a programmer, but no-one's willing to help you for free. What I meant, Robin, was that people are being scared away from the engine by people who are imitating you, and you as well. Starting out with something new is always confusing, and what you say to these people seriously knocks their confidence. People may not have thought to look at the instructions before mucking around with the software, and your comments of 'If you can't read instructions you shouldn't be in games design' are unwarranted, because a lot of us think of this as a hobby. I have never once seen you post something positive on anyone's work, Robin. If you stopped being so condescending and horrid to newbs, there'd be more of them and we'd have a lot less people acting like idiots because of it.

Because a lot of people won't mess around with the source, it's too daunting. There's no new people bringng new ideas. VB6 programming is just too confusing for me. I've had days when I've thought, 'Right, I'll sit down and learn these tutorials on VB6', but it just doesn't click for me. I like the idea of just neatly writing up scripts and plugging them into the engine appeals to me. Maybe then, when we have a simple way of doing things, it will evolve and people will know how to program properly in VB6. @Robin, then maybe scripting should be added to a split-off of EO. @Homepage: > The communities were just the same old people arguing over programming methods yet never actually making any games. It was a sorry state of affairs and an ugly end to a bunch of communities which had such a long and vibrant past. We're going down the same slippery slope that all the other communities did. I don't want to see Eclipse die, but I'd rather see Eclipse dead than full of people who scare off the newbs, judge others, argue and generally be arseholes to each other, _which is what is happenening now._Take a wild stab at how many people must have buggered off to G2D, Xtremeworlds or the other engines because of how people have copied you and insulted their work. If we don't get a handle on Eclipse we're going to end up in the same position Mirage Realms, Elysium and Player Worlds are in now - we're going to lose Eclipse itself. Break down the old Eclipse that everyone knew and loved, and what did we have? A fun community, an engine full of features, and people who were ready to help each other. Nowadays we have a 'base', an unfriendly community and a small army of idiots who copy your every move, Robin. You've fostered a community of hostility and no-one can or will do anything for fear of retribution. You're saying that if you want something done, you have to do it yourself, but the state of Eclipse is suffocating creativity and rendering impossible situations to make something good without being attacked by everyone. And no-one, **no-one** who can do something about this will do it.

Not too bad, but remember where the MOTD will go. And try adding a border round the blood-splats, it looks odd that they just stop. I like the text, too.

Adding scripting into EO is well beyond my capabilities and I'm pretty sure if I wrote a thread about ES and people using it, it would be deleted. I think Renzo's hit the nail on the head, maybe we should let people casually use ES. Think, Robin, about Crystalshire. It's a simple, but glossy 2D ORPG. It has good graphics, doesn't tax your brain to play it and there's zero bugs. That's your idea of an ORPG. Then think about Ambardia. In the short time I spent playing it before it went into re-development, I enjoyed it massively. At first I blanched at the graphics, but after a while it felt like an old game I'd been playing for years and felt comfortable in. And in that's in two weeks of play altogether. The features were fun to delve into and the whole feel of 'This game was put together by an amateur group of people who just made whatever they liked' just stuck. Ecipse Stable is full of bugs, that's true. But those of us who might benefit from it as casual developers are being cut off with 'Don't use Stable, it'll kill your project'. We're not looking for something to be the next Runescape or WoW. Maybe just an all-purpose board with tutorials and questions and answers for the use of ES might be a good idea. If we can get ES up and running again, and try and be nicer to people, we'd all be better for it.

The whole problem is that everyone who can program is getting sick of doing things for us who can't. Like my earlier post, maybe we should have someone dissect EO and put scripting into it for those of us who can't. We just need to tell people that whilst scripting is easier, that's not a reason to just throw systems together. Alot of people need an attitude adjustment in the meantime. If we were nicer to the newbs and helped them even if their question is 'Server's down, how can I sort that?' just tell them to go in the server folder and kindly point them in the direction of the official guides and FAQ. EO is better than ES perhaps tenfold, but if scripting was re-added we'd maybe have some more new ideas in. Personally I think everyone just mainly wants the three big things, Pets, Quests and Speech Bubbles. If we did have some good scripts for these we'd have many more people releasing their own original tutorials or expansions on the official ones. Maybe we could set it up like the projects forum? So the tutorial is only added if it's properly written. I understand no-one wants to take over development of EO, and Eclipse C is going to be a while, but this might be a good comprimise in the meantime. @⠛ʍEи: > And you guys need to stop worshiping Robin, and start worshiping me again! You and your foul-eggnog-hating-temptress ways. Never.

In a way, Justn, yes, but I would like scripting. Scripting isn't a broken feature. It was just done haphazardly before and know everyone avoids it like the plague. We're not saying that 'ZOMG BRINGBACK STABEL :@!!111!!!!1!', just that scripting sounds a helluva lot easier to me. Also, we're not suggesting it, merely evaluating the state of Eclipse. The software has improved, the community has degraded. Just look at most of the Legend and Veteran groups, mostly they're not working on anything Eclipse-wise because they're bored of it. They know whatever they make will be pulled apart by newbs trying to get a leg-up on a supposedly important Eclipse social ladder they've metaphorically invented for themselves. Those who come out with good projects or versions of Eclipse are likely to have so many heads thrust up their rear end that it could be fatal to remove them. Eclipse needs to stop being so judgemental, arrogant and defensive. EO is a great piece of software to make professional games. You can create a fully fledged MMO with it, just look at Crystalshire. Then look at the exstensive amount of work needed to seperate that from the rest of the Enterbrain-doused projects gathering dust in the EP section and contemplate how much you'd need to pay a programmer to do something like that for you.

Having not known the 'Old Eclipse', as you call it, I can't really tell. All I know is this forum is full of junior members imitating Robin and generally insulting people without prior knowledge of what they're talking about and trying to assert dominance and superiority in a forum that really doesn't warrant it. I, personally, think EO was a step in the right direction as a whole, but there's a few issues: * It's too difficult to modify the engine * There's no features I like the idea of EO being written to avoid bugs and increase flexibility, but the lack of features is just being re-labelled as 'Well not everyone is going to use these features'. Perhaps we should add scripting back in to a custom version for those that seriously want it, bring back the scripting boards, and have a set of de-facto scripts for Guilds, Speech Bubbles, Mounts, etcetera, that everyone wants? And how many times have I tried sitting down at VBtutor and followed tutorials? And I still just can't get it. It doesn't click for me. A scripting engine might ease that a little and grow a little more creativity in this ever-decaying forum. The past few years and the gradually defunct software should serve as a warning to what can happen if it isn't done properly, but not a reason to boycott the same pillars TE/EE/ES stood on. Everyone nowadays thinks they'll have the next best MMO by using Enterbrain's graphics in the default EO, so what we really need is a list of the most popular Eclipse Games and a directory of approved games labelled by style/genre with a description of their good and bad features. It could foster a more friendly Eclipse.

Apparently I have: * slightly expressed extravert * distinctively expressed intuitive personality * slightly expressed feeling personality * distinctively expressed judging personality

@Justn: > Oh is that lightnings tutorial? I haven't even added that yet =/ can you change fonts with it too? > Did you add a timer to frmMain and set it up right? It should all be there i'll look to see if i missed anything =/ Yeah, the timer's set up properly and everything. Do you have a blank EO with this in it?

Elsewhere, now when I type, the text won't go off the screen. Do you get what I meant when I said I was a crap programmer?

Stupid me, I didn't. Sorry, :P Muchos thanks for the code, BTW.

I'm getting 'Method or Data member not found and it's hilighting: ``` text = Player(Index).message ``` I have no idea what I did wrong D:

There's millions of tutorials on the internet for pixel art, just have a look around and you'll improve. For the outlines so far, you should round the corners of the road a little, make the roads wider and make each brick in the wall an even side. Remember that where your black lines are will be mortar. The huge advertisement is completely flat, it needs 3Dicating. It might look good if you had a changing picture over it, showing in game events. The lines in the road are just lines, they're too thin to be proper road markings. You should probably change the stop sign to be floating around somewhere, in case you want to use it elsewhere. It's also flay on the bottom, not rounded. Try putting some grass tufts? That's all I can think right now.

@renzo: > Everyone should just stay 9-year-olds forever. You'd love that, Renzo, and we all know why ;)

@Ryoku: > talk to justn, he has a pseudo chat bubble system made for EO, and it works quite nicely. > > but you might want to use a different to draw then he uses XD Sssh, it's a secret! >:D Anyway, there's a really bad tutorial called visual in game messages, written by kibbelz. Just do a search for it :)