Public Apology.

[Ezemel]

Let's take as an example a game that managed to survive only with Supporter Packs and cosmetics. [Very very rare for a game to be Free and non Pay2Win]

[I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the game's name]

People Support the game because they want to play the game more enjoying a better experience.

Same will be with the engine, wich will get Support for further development, IF they will be pro enough and nice enough to talk to their community whenever there is something bothering it.

There really is no competition, maybe I'm blind, but there is no 2D MMORPG Engine out there that ain't in vb6, when EclipseV will come out, it will be the only one, at least for a certain amount of time.

**As for the Official Scripts and Custom Made ones here is my idea**

**Anyone is free to Post their Own Scripts, though, those who want to make money off of them, first it will need to go trough a few steps:**

**1\. The Script needs to be analyzed by the staff, making sure there is no theft**

**2\. After 1#, the Scripts needs to get Approved **

**3\. If the Script is Approved, then the Owner will put a Price on it**

**4\. An x% amount of the revenue goes to Eclipse [Eclipse is nice enough to let you sell your stuff in here, now help Eclipse a bit too]**

**Example: Blabla Script, Price: 10$, Eclipse's Share: 20%  [Depending on the price, there needs to be some sort of formula wich will generate a Fair amount of Share, or 20% might be alright]**

[Richy420Rich]

> Let's take as an example a game that managed to survive only with Supporter Packs and cosmetics. [Very very rare for a game to be Free and non Pay2Win]
>
> [I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the game's name]
>
>  
>
> People Support the game because they want to play the game more enjoying a better experience.
>
>  
>
> Same will be with the engine, wich will get Support for further development, IF they will be pro enough and nice enough to talk to their community whenever there is something bothering it.
>
>  
>
> There really is no competition, maybe I'm blind, but there is no 2D MMORPG Engine out there that ain't in vb6, when EclipseV will come out, it will be the only one, at least for a certain amount of time.
>
>  
>
> **As for the Official Scripts and Custom Made ones here is my idea**
>
>  
>
> **Anyone is free to Post their Own Scripts, though, those who want to make money off of them, first it will need to go trough a few steps:**
>
>  
>
> **1\. The Script needs to be analyzed by the staff, making sure there is no theft**
>
> **2\. After 1#, the Scripts needs to get Approved **
>
> **3\. If the Script is Approved, then the Owner will put a Price on it**
>
> **4\. An x% amount of the revenue goes to Eclipse [Eclipse is nice enough to let you sell your stuff in here, now help Eclipse a bit too]**
>
>  
>
> **Example: Blabla Script, Price: 10$, Eclipse's Share: 20%  [Depending on the price, there needs to be some sort of formula wich will generate a Fair amount of Share, or 20% might be alright]**

Any game out right now, had to spend a load of cash to even begin developing, as I've heard many times; "It takes money to make money."

Of course over the long term of the games life, they ought be able to profit off of cosmetics and donations; Provided the customers preference.

The same could be for an engine, but like I said in the underlined quote.

As for competitions… I was refering to a competition with other modern day engines, if Eclipse does move towards a modern day language, Eclipse will be competing with like minded engines, obviously not by choice, but for traffic I/O.

And your system sounds okay but.... By the time the owner pays all these people to analyze, approve scripts, he'll be negative and in the same boat he's in right now? :P

Once the owner gets paid, the staff automatically sees that as they should get paid also, their time spent is just as much (if not more) than the owner, so by rights.... Eh? Lol, I doubt anyone is going to do for free if it hits a big popularity jackpot.

[Ezemel]

Lol…

Always seeing the bad part...

[Richy420Rich]

Lol… Or just being real.

[Ezemel]

Didn't happen, so, you can only assume, meaning that being "real" is useless.

A lot of people fail because they always put the bad part in front of them, that doesn't make them smarter or stronger.

I, personally, better regret doing a thing, than regreting for not doing it.

[Gwen]

Eclipse used to be a free mmorpg maker. does anyone use the old address to come here anymore? freemmorpgmaker.com ring a bell? When eclipse was thriving it was free… people helped others because of the love of programming and community. The only time money was changed was when people offered their help to program features that were not in the standard version, and this was a per person situation. The idea of being paid for eclipse completely goes against what eclipse was originally started as.

Eclipse will always be a hobbyist program, and quite honestly should be free, but donations should definitely be encouraged. If you are looking to get rich off eclipse you are at the wrong level of game making.

[Exception]

I find it hilarious that Eclipse is still in the loop of

development > excitement > disappointment > anger > suggestion > development ad nauseum 

Though I suppose I can't really say much, having perpetuated one of those cycles…

Anyway, from what I can figure, these things that I learned the hard way apply to Eclipse quite well:

**1) Bad habits**

The pattern here is that things go wrong around the excitement point, because promise of something new is either overhyped or hyped faaaaaaar too early and people become disappointed or get bored. 

If you don't break out of that, this will only happen again.

When things start to pick up, you set yourselves up for failure or massive delays again by _**upscaling** your targets._

I saw it happen way too many times up until I left, I can still see it happening now, and it happened to me far too many times to count.

It was part of the reason I left, I got fed up with game development in itself. I have 6 completed games now but tons and tons of half-finished engines and proof-of-concepts.

It should be the other way around, if things go haywire, figure out why it went wrong and simplify matters. Even if you fail again, keeping to that cycle is better because at the very least, something gets _done_ at the end.

**2) Too much speaking, too little action**

You say you're going to do these things. Well? Do it, then. Focus on getting something functional, and by definition playable. The moment that it's a state where players can input controls to control a character…release it! Follow an iterative release pattern. Develop based on player feedback, stuff like music or pretty graphics can be done as you go along. _Don't_ start by preparing your assets, drawing up multiple plans, interface sketches, etcetc.

**3) It's acceptable to quit.**

From what I can figure, this is still a stigma here. If a project is draining at you, by using too much time, or draining at your health, or you're simply bored of it and it's admittedly not much fun…drop it. Learn what went wrong, and begin whatever else you want to do and get right to it. Don't even look back to the dropped project.

I have probably hundreds of failed projects that failed for their own reasons whether it was out of my scope, or I got bored, or I didn't have enough time to finish it in the foreseeable future (ie. got impatient), etc, and honestly, I don't give a crap, I'm better at what I try to do now for it.

tldr: do as I say not as I (mostly previously did) do.

also, stop using vb6 ffs.

[Mal]

I think the biggest pitfall, and Carim described it, is loss of interest, fallouts, or lack of resources. Its easy to come up with a great idea, but its exceedingly difficult to procure talent, set, music, and most of all time.

[SkywardRiver]

It's still just a hobby however. If anyone thinks you can make a living off of your Eclipse game (much less, your Eclipse 4.0 game) then you're sadly mistaken. For me, at least, it's never been about the prospect of money. It's the fun of making the project, whatever it's for. Yes, there are times when making a game actually changes from being fun to being work, but it's ONLY gonna be the games that push through this slump that are ever going to be enjoyed.

[Mal]

That's what I've always said, Sky. Its a hobby. ;)

[Mohenjo Daro]

Why Eclipse decided to make this a business, I'll never know, it ran better as a hobby and it was much more enjoyable.

[Growlith1223]

Eclipse didn't decide, the owner did.

[Mohenjo Daro]

Last I checked, if you just go with it then you decided, the team could have dropped it until it was decided otherwise, but I think they wanted or didn't mind getting paid.

[Link]

No one on the team gets paid. Most if not all of the staff stick around because they have a love for the community, abandoning it wouldn't exactly make it any better when you could at-least do the best on your part as a staff member so it's not exactly going with it, to me anyway.

[lexkymbeth]

I just read the last page of this and it seems like everyone is fighting here :S

Should lift the mood

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcvjoWOwnn4

[Guest]

Im happy to host tinychats, but im banned 99% of the time over stupid reasons. I agree with what some of you have said… theres a hell of a lot of random censorship.

[Mohenjo Daro]

To philosophical lol, but thanks for the share, I guess I'm just annoyed because of how little communication usually goes on and how much info is changed, I've come to the belief that the team was paid, if they aren't then ok, I don't get the price them but alright, I just like knowing what goes on in the background that we don't see but the team knows about, I'd rather look at a change log and see that they fixed one bug in a month than have done nothing over a year.

It may not be needed, but being told of what actually is happening helps a lot and really does improve hope, pride, and the mood of everyone.

[Link]

I'm going to lock this topic, it will no longer be a debate. The main post covers the point, thanks for inputting your opinions.